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Chappell:
When did you actually turn pro?
Jacobs:
In 1958. I had about twelve matches in New
Zealand, and then I got a deal with a promoter to
get my Visa and everything and go to Hawaii. Al
Karasick was the promoter in Hawaii.
Chappell:
What was it like wrestling in Hawaii?
Jacobs:
(laughs) I didn’t realize I had it so good
…I was on the beach everyday and only wrestled
about once a week! Walking the beach at Waikiki…I
looked like a native after three months on the beach
there!
Chappell:
Do you recall your debut match as a pro?
Jacobs:
Funny thing, I was just talking to a guy about
that. My debut match was a Main Event!
Chappell:
Really?
Jacobs:
Yes, it was with ‘Zebra Kid,’ George Bollas.
George Bollas was a Big 10 Champ, way back. He was
from Columbus, Ohio, but he was in New Zealand
touring. The match was in Hastings, New Zealand.
Chappell:
Describe the transition for you from amateur
wrestling to professional wrestling.
Jacobs:
Actually, it tended to be fairly easy. I had
watched the guys wrestle, and wrestled a lot of the
pros. A lot of the amateurs that were going to turn
professional, I wrestled them as well. So…I just
went from ‘there’ to ‘there.’ I was lucky
that I had spent so much time wrestling amateur.
Chappell:
Well, with your amateur background, you really
had the pure wrestling part of professional
wrestling down before you even started as a pro!
(laughs)
Jacobs:
Yeah…I knew all the holds already! (laughs)
Chappell:
When did make it onto the U.S. mainland?
Jacobs:
I spent three months wrestling in Hawaii, and
then I came to the mainland. The first guy I
wrestled for on the mainland was Vince McMahon, Sr.
I wrestled in the Northeast for a year or so, and
then I went out to Detroit and wrestled around
there…and also in Chicago.
I
remember taking the bus from Washington, D.C. to New
York to see a Doctor so I could get licensed by [the
New York State Athletic] Commission. I’m thinking,
‘How in the hell am I going to find my way around
New York!’ I’m from this little island, and now
I’m in the biggest city in the world! But
actually, I was scared for nothing…it’s the
easiest place in the world to find your way around
in. The avenues go one way, and the streets go the
other.
Chappell:
Not those terrible traffic circles! (laughs) You
mentioned Chicago…weren’t you part of a big
house there?
Jacobs:
Yes. In Chicago, I was in one of the big houses
that they had in Comiskey Park. They had that first
one…they had about 36,000 people. They had a
bigger one after that, I think about 40,000 for
(Buddy) Rogers and (Pat) O’Connor. I wasn’t on
the second one…but I was on the first one that had
36,000.
Chappell:
Who did you wrestle on that first Comiskey Park
show?
Jacobs:
(pauses) Let me think…I think it was Johnny
Walker.
Chappell:
Who would later go on to fame as Mr. Wrestling
II.
Jacobs:
Yes, Johnny ‘Rubberman’ Walker. It’s hard
for me to remember for sure, though, because I’ve
had over 8,000 matches! (laughs)
It’s
really hard to remember individual matches, unless
it was an extra special card or something extra
special happened in the match. Of course, you would
wrestle a lot of the same guys different times.
Chappell:
You traveled a great deal, Abe. Tell us about
going to Japan.
Jacobs:
The first time I went to Japan was 1966, I
believe. I was there a bunch of times.
Chappell:
Didn’t you wrestle under a mask in Japan, as
the ‘Red Pimpernel’?
Jacobs:
Yeah, they wanted to put a mask on me and call
me the ‘Scarlet Pimpernel.’ I said, ‘You call
me anything you want to.’ (laughs)
Chappell:
But just make sure you pay me, right? (laughs)
Jacobs:
Yeah! So, anyways, the ‘Red Pimpernel’ came
from…the nearest they could get to ‘Scarlet’
was ‘Red.’ [Editor’s Note: Abe does a great
ring introduction of himself from Japan] So…they
would announce me as the ‘Reddddddo
Pimpernellllllllly.’ So that was it. (laughs)
I
went back to Japan three or four times, and I always
wrestled under the mask there.
Chappell:
Did you enjoy wrestling in Japan?
Jacobs:
(pauses) Well…yes and no. It was kind of tough
for me over there, really. Everything is
different…the language situation was tough. It’s
a heck of a country and all, but you know, to each
his own. Like I was born and raised on a small
island…a lot of people wouldn’t like that, I
know.
Chappell:
I’m sure all the traveling had to be tough at
times…being away from home.
Jacobs:
It’s funny, David, later somebody I knew went
over [to New Zealand] to wrestle and when he came
back he said, ‘Didn’t you come from New Zealand,
Abe? I asked a bunch of people when I was over there
and no one had ever heard of Abe Jacobs.’
(everybody laughs)
Chappell:
How soon they forget! (laughs)
Jacobs:
(laughing) I told him, ‘Well, I only had ten
or twelve matches there as a pro, but I had a bunch
as an amateur. If you’d asked the amateurs, they
would have known me!’
Chappell:
Of course, I remember you from the Mid-Atlantic
area wrestling as a babyface. Did you ever wrestle
as a heel?
Jacobs:
Well, some places they liked me and some places
they didn’t. You could go out and wrestle one way
one day, and wrestle the same way the next day…and
depending on the crowd, the reaction could be
completely different.
Chappell:
And I guess it could depend on whom you were
wrestling.
Jacobs:
Sure…you might be wrestling that town’s
favorite guy. In Japan for example…I wrestled
(Antonio) Inoki. You know, the guy who fought
Cassius Clay. I wrestled Inoki many, many
times…from the north to the south. But no matter
where I was in Japan, the people there hated my guts
when I wrestled Inoki! (laughs)
Chappell:
What are some other memorable places you
wrestled outside the U.S.?
Jacobs:
South Africa comes to mind…talking about
people not liking you! You know, I roped calves and
did a bunch of different stuff with rope…I would
wear Western gear and the Cowboy hat and everything.
There
was no television in South Africa. The promoter over
there picks me up and takes me to four newspapers,
and the papers were taking my picture and the whole
bit. Then, they started asking me questions about
their Champion. And, I hadn’t heard of their
Champion…I REALLY hadn’t heard of their
Champion. (everybody laughs)
They
asked me how I’d do over there, and I said,
‘Well, I guess I’m going to do all
right…I’ve wrestled the best in the world.’
Then they said, ‘How are you going to do against
so-and-so?’ I said, ‘Who’s that?’ And,
‘so-and-so’ turned out to be their Champion!
(everybody laughs)
Chappell:
Uh oh! (laughs)
Jacobs:
Yeah, I guess I said the wrong thing! (laughs)
Chappell:
I guess it’s fair to say you weren’t the
most popular guy in South Africa!
Jacobs:
It gets worse!
Chappell:
How so?
Jacobs:
Anyways, that night I went to the hotel and
thought I was done for the day. I had traveled a
long ways to get there…and Johannesburg was about
6,000 feet up.
But
the promoter tells me, ‘I’ll pick you up in an
hour.’ I said, ‘What for…I want to get some
sleep. I’m tired from all this travel.’ He told
me that I had to go and wrestle before the South
Africa Wrestling Commission. I said, ‘Why?’ He
told me, ‘They want to know if you’re a
wrestler, or not.’ (laughs)
Chappell:
What??
Jacobs:
I told the promoter that I had sent over all my
publicity information, pictures and so forth. He
said, ‘That’s not good enough. You won’t get a
license unless they see you.’
Chappell:
So, what happened when you went up before this
Commission?
Jacobs:
I had to do it…these [Commissioners] were just
staring at you. They were pretty tough people over
there in those days.
I
had to wrestle three different guys. I tell you,
David, I was glad for my amateur wrestling
experience then!
Chappell:
I bet!
Jacobs:
I have to wrestle these three guys. We’re
6,000 feet up and the air is thin. I had also eaten
the wrong food over in India and still felt
bad…and I’d lost a lot of weight!
Chappell:
This sounds like a nightmare. (laughs)
Jacobs:
Well, I got through the three guys. I told the
last one, ‘So, you think I’m a wrestler now?’
(laughs) I shouldn’t have said that. I guess I was
sort of a smart [aleck] by saying that…their
Commission had rules and they were just following
them. But I still felt sick, and was just perturbed
by the whole thing.
But,
let me tell you about losing all that weight. That
led to another problem for me in South
Africa…funny little story.
Chappell:
Okay…
Jacobs:
The promoter over there was a guy by the name of
Bull Heffer…God bless him, he’s passed away now.
Before I came over to wrestle for him, he asked me
how big I was. I told him I was as big as he needed
me to be…I had a trip to Japan planned also and
they wanted me big over there.
I
was about 270-275 (pounds) then, and I had worked
out on the weights and had eaten a lot. Bull was
pleased when he heard that, because his Champion was
a big guy then and he didn’t want the Challenger
small in comparison.
Anyways,
I had eaten the wrong food in India. And believe me,
if anyone was going to get sick, it was going to be
me. I was so sick, that I couldn’t even leave the
country for a while. I couldn’t even leave my
hotel room…I was in the bathroom for what seemed
like forever! That’s how bad it was!
Chappell:
No wonder you lost all that weight!
Jacobs:
Yeah…I was terribly dehydrated and lost weight
so fast. And as I said, I was still sick when I
finally got to South Africa…and I had to wrestle
these three guys and convince their Commission that
I was a wrestler. And they put me on the scales for
that thing…and the promoter was there of course…
Chappell:
Oh…and this was the promoter that wanted you
to be large to face his large Champion…
Jacobs:
Yeah! The promoter looked at me and said, ‘You
lied to me about your weight, didn’t you?’ I
told him that I didn’t lie about it, that I had
gotten sick and lost more than 20 pounds, and that I
could put it back on in no time flat when I got to
feeling right again.
Anyways,
he didn’t believe me…he thought I had lied to
him about my weight earlier.
Chappell:
So, what happened with you and Bull Heffer then?
Jacobs:
Well, about two weeks later I was wrestling in
Pretoria…that’s the capital of South Africa. I
went into the big old dusty building there, and they
were weighing guys with their clothes on. I went
into a back room, and they had some scales in
there…you know, the old kind of scales where you
would put all the weights on the scale to balance it
out?
Chappell:
Right…like the ones you see a lot of times at
a Doctor’s office.
Jacobs:
Yeah…and I came from the outside and had my
suit and Cowboy boots on….
Chappell:
Okay Abe…I think I see where this may be
going! Those little weights didn’t find their way
into your Cowboy boots by chance, did they?
(laughs)
Jacobs:
(pauses) They just happened to JUMP into my
boots! (laughs) So, I filled both of my Cowboy boots
up with those weights. And I had my suit on, so I
put some in my pockets. But in a suit, you
couldn’t put too many in because it would hang
down…but I put just enough in there so it looked
right. But my boots were full…and I had to walk so
they wouldn’t clink!
Chappell:
(laughing)
Jacobs:
Those things were sticking into my shins, and
were hurting like a son of a gun! So, I walked very
SLOWLY through the door and into the room where they
were weighing the guys.
The
promoter was there weighing the guys. I said,
‘Bull, you weighing guys? You want to weigh me
right now…I’m here.’ He said, ‘Yeah,
yeah…get on [the scales].’ I get on the scales
slowly so the weights in my shoes won’t make a
noise. I get up there on the scales and they put a
weight on…and then they put another weight
on…and then they put another weight on! (laughs)
The promoter keeps looking at the scales…
Chappell:
You became a real heavyweight all of a sudden!
(laughs)
Jacobs:
David, I became a SUPER heavyweight! (everybody
laughs)
I
was way up…I was probably over 270 pounds. I was
at least around the weight I had told Bull
originally. I said to him, ‘You thought I was
lying didn’t you?’ He said, ‘Kid…yeah…you
look bigger. You been working out hard, right?’ I
said, ‘Sure I’ve been working out, you know
that. You okay with me now?’ He said, ‘Yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah.’ I walked away from him real
slow, and I couldn’t get those weights out of my
boots fast enough! (everybody laughs)
Chappell:
That’s funny! It sounds like South Africa was
a wild place for you!
Jacobs:
‘Wild’ is a good word. I’ll tell you about
another incident I had in South Africa.
New
Zealand’s national sport is rugby, and I played a
lot of rugby. South Africa’s national sport is
rugby also. So one time while I was over there, they
were having a big game in Johannesburg. I asked the
guys from the office if they were going to the rugby
game, and they said they were. And they let me go
with them…
Chappell:
Sounds like fun!
Jacobs:
Yeah, right! (laughs) We had good seats and all,
but when we got in the stadium…I had my Cowboy hat
on and everybody recognizes me. Somebody says,
‘HEY, THERE’S THE YANK!’ Over there, everybody
from the States is a ‘Yank,’ doesn’t matter if
you’re from the South or not! Everybody starts
yelling that at me, and eventually they start
yelling the old saying, ‘HEY YANKEE—GO HOME!’
Chappell:
Whoa…I don’t imagine that made you feel real
comfortable.
Jacobs:
Well, then, somebody starts throwing oranges at
me. And, there are about 10,000 people in the
stands, and now all the people start looking at me.
I have this hat on…the only hat within 10,000
miles!
Chappell:
Yeah, you’re kind of standing out there like a
sore thumb Abe.
Jacobs:
Everybody knew who I was, so when one orange
would hit me, the whole stadium would start up doing
it. It was like being in a hailstorm! There was an
exit right there near us, and I said to the guy I
was sitting with, ‘We’re gone.’ He was getting
hit too, and he said, ‘I’ve never seen anything
like this!’ So, we went out to his car…
Chappell:
And got the heck out of there!
Jacobs:
Well, not exactly! (laughs)
Chappell:
What?!
Jacobs:
I asked the guy that brought me to the game,
‘Do you have a jacket and a baseball cap?’ He
said, ‘Yeah, in the trunk of the car.’ I asked
him if I could borrow them, and he let me. I took
off my suit coat and hat and put them in his truck,
and put his jacket and baseball cap on. He said,
‘What are you doing?’ I said, ‘We’re going
to a rugby match!’ He said, ‘They’ll kill you
back there!’
Chappell:
What happened?!
Jacobs:
I finally talked him into going back in
there…we go back there, and nobody recognizes me!
We had a good time, and after it was over I gave him
his jacket and baseball cap back and said,
‘Thanks!!’ (laughs)
Chappell:
Some fast thinking! (laughs)
Jacobs:
Just another adventure when wrestling overseas!
(laughs)
PART
THREE |
